Fragmented Marketing And Systems Will Hurt Your Business

Episode Overview

One of the reasons most business owners struggle, is because they spend most of their time doing things they are least qualified to do, and very little time, focussing on what they do best.

Every second spent dicking about with Adwords, Facebook, Infusionsoft, Autoresponders, Direct Mail Lists etc.. Is a second NOT spent effectively growing your business. All of the above needs to be done, but as a business owner, you do not have the time to become an expert in every field.

When most business owners get in front of the right prospect, their closure rate is likely to be close to 100%, so it would seem reasonable for a business owner to spend virtually ALL of their time in front of the right prospect, whilst leaving the myriad of other “business running tasks” to others.

Show notes

Click here to come and join us at “Build A Better Business Live” on Thursday, 12 May 2016

Transcript (Click To Open)

Hi there. Thanks for joining us at another Build a Better Business podcast. My name’s Pieter De Villiers and today I’m joined by my colleague, David Brown, who is up in Scotland. Say hi, David.

Hi, David.

So we thought we’d have a chat today about the risks or the pitfalls and the issues that you might come across if you look at either your marketing or your systems and processes, the different lead gen you’re using, any follow up, anything like that. What the issues are if you do this in a fragmented manner.

Lots of business owners approach these things like shiny new objects. “I need to do PPC.” “Oh, I need a CRM system.” I need Infusion Soft.” “I need this. I need that.” And they’re not into leads. They’re not thinking of these things as complete systems and there are many issues you can get into.

So we’ll start off just with a review of the issues you might come across, let’s say for instance between PPC and your landing pages. David…

Yeah, well I came across this first of all after working on lots and lots of different Adwords accounts and I’ve always thought that Adwords management 50 per cent of it is getting the Adwords straight. That’s getting the right key words, the right negatives, the right ads, relevancy and things like that, but the other 50 per cent is what happens when the traffic gets to the landing page.
I think one of the challenges is that often with business owners the website has been written and developed by somebody else and it’s often the case that it’s very difficult to actually make contact easily with the person who has written or developed the website, which means making changes to the website or landing page become tedious or difficult to say the least.

Why is this important? It’s important because everything that you do, not just in paid traffic, in Adwords, but everything you do in marketing needs to be tested. It needs to be tested with a live audience and in fact Peter and I often say that we don’t really care what our clients think about something. In fact we don’t really care what we think about something because ultimately it’s what our target audience thinks. If our target audience likes an ad, they click on it. If they don’t like our ad and don’t click on it, then we need to make changes and we need to make those changes very, very quickly in order to continue the test.

So often Adwords and the landing page of the website are actually to a certain extent disassociated. There’s obviously a link between the ad and the landing page, but when somebody’s managing an Adword and somebody else is managing the landing page, certainly in my experience it can be very, very difficult to get these changes made quickly. And by quickly, or by lack of speed, I’ve experienced two, three, four, five weeks waiting for web developers to make changes. Sometimes these changes are very small and sometimes when we make that change, we might want to make a similar change – another small change – but we need to make it quickly.

When we set up 48 Hour Launch we were absolutely adamant that making changes to landing pages would be entirely within our grasp. The way we do that is we actually effectively bolt on many websites to the existing website, so we’re not constrained by our clients’ website. We’re not constrained by our clients’ web developer to actually make the changes because we’re using our little mini website or bubble, which is attached to the website and we can then make changes very, very quickly. As I said, the reason we need to make the changes quickly is because we are testing the audience, we’re testing the audience’s reaction to something and the quicker we can respond to their reaction the quicker we can get a more relevant ad in front of the right audience.

The other advantage that we also see in having this bubble tag onto the main website, apart from the fact that it gives us the opportunity to make changes really quickly, is also that it allows slight separation – not really in branding and that – but on the one hand the customer they’ve got their website which they’re very happy with and that’s what they want to build almost like a store front for themselves and it doesn’t interfere with what we’re doing because we can go out and create the right message for generating traffic. And when we build the bubble it’s not just one or two pages. We do sometimes end up with eight, nine, ten pages in this bubble website with full navigation and a lot of the elements that you have on the main website also exists within the bubble. It just gives us full control without having to have any concern about what might happen to the customer’s website or where the web developer is. We’ve carried out launches where we’re testing landing pages and we’re testing sequences and things and we need to make three changes in the course of as many hours and we have the advantage where we don’t need to call anyone. We don’t need to wait for anyone to get back to us.

I think what happens a lot of the time is people, web developers are very happy to build websites. Big project, get it out the door, but then when it comes to tweaking, maintenance, optimising, anything like that, they’ve moved onto the next big website they’re building and they’re not really that keen on being involved with what it is you’re trying to achieve on a page by page basis.

Yeah, this could be something as simple as word order. It could be a headline or a page name and as Peter says web developers are really, really keen to do the really, really complex stuff. We’re not talking about anything complex. We’re talking about making some very, very fine subtle changes, but changes that may change the click through rate of an ad from 5 per cent to 5.5 per cent. All these little incremental changes do make a big difference and of course the more successful the keyword, if we’re using Adwords, the key word in the ad combination and landing pages, the less we actually pay and that’s quite a significant point.

What we’re trying to do is we’re trying to attract the right type of traffic, but we’re also trying to attract the right type of traffic at a very, very good price because you could attract the right traffic but pay an extortionate amount for it and consequently make the return on your investment very, very difficult to achieve.

And the other thing, I’ve mentioned return on investment. The other thing that’s nigh on impossible really to measure is when you are using a website developed by somebody else, we might not be able to or can’t get the right conversion and tracking code put onto it. Tracking, making sure, you can properly attribute the source of your lead to a subsequent sale or opt in box being filled. Again, because we’ve got complete control of the bubble we can use our own telephone tracking numbers. We can put our own conversion code on it and what it then does is it makes it much easier for us and obviously much easier to report back to our clients a properly calculated return on investment.

You need to be able to measure. It’s all very well having a successful Adwords account that gives ‘X’ number of impressions and ‘Y’ number of clicks and ‘Z’ number of conversions, but ultimately as business owners the thing that’s extremely important to us all is that if we spend a pound, do we get 50p back or do we get £1.50 back? Quite often a lot of people don’t know that and some people bail out at the wrong time and they don’t realise they’re actually making a positive return and other people bail out because they don’t think they’re getting a return. Just some simple tweaks and proper testing and we really can’t stress that enough. Proper testing of your audience’s reaction would just be enough to get you in the positive return on investment.

Yeah, you’ve also had in the past with it being fragmented between the traffic driver and actually the location you’re spending traffic to is where you could drive 300 odd prospects to a landing page, but because the landing page is not appropriate, it’s not been tested, it doesn’t convert and you’ve got no control over it, you get kick back from your client saying “Adwords doesn’t work.” It’s like actually we got 300 people to knock on your door this month. However, it wasn’t of interest to them.
And that also leads on the tracking and the management of what you need to do once someone does knock on your door because it’s all good and well saying “Okay, we’ve driven so many people to this page, but if there’s no means of telling how many people actually opted in or took you up on the offer or anything like that, and then following up with those prospects further down the line, then you are also either not aware of what your return on investment is, but also you’re unable to optimise that and increase that return on investment through follow up, server offers or sales or conversion further down the track.

Yeah, an awful lot of marketing, particularly digital marketing, seems to be gut feel and it doesn’t have to be because the information is there. If we take the time and trouble to put the tracking in place to measure because once you’re able to measure something you’re then able to make some very, very sensible and smart decisions as to what works, what doesn’t work, what needs to be tweaked, what needs to be improved, what needs to be optimised or indeed what needs to have more money spent on it.

Therein lies one of the biggest challenges for business owners. If you spent £1000 on paid traffic one month, do you spend £1000 the next month or do you spend £2000 the next month? I know from experience of my own family business, The Scottish Shutter Company, whose marketing we now manage as the 48 Hour Launch, that in the past it was actually very difficult. It wasn’t gut feel. We knew people were getting in contact. People were coming through doors and it was more of a gut feel that Adwords was working, but I tell you what, it was a great experience when you can actually measure exactly how much business you got from a spend on Adwords in Facebook, because you can then say with confidence, “I tell you what. We’ll spend that amount of money that month and we should get the same results. But if we spend a bit money then we would expect even better results.” And again that becomes another test in that there will be a point – the law of diminishing returns – where you start to spend too much money and you’re not getting a significant increase in conversions or sales depending on what it is you’re doing.

As I say, it was a great day when we are able to give the team at The Scottish Shutter Company a dashboard which allows them to see on a hourly, daily, weekly, monthly basis exactly what the spend is and how much return they’ve got from that spend. And it does make spending money with Google an awful lot easier.

Yeah, if you can relate it directly to where it’s gone.
Now you guys use it. We use it a lot with ours. You guys use it in your family business as well and we use it pretty much with all of our clients. Infusion Soft, now whilst we might discussion Infusion Soft in particular, a bit like the BBC other products are available. Don’t think that if you don’t have Infusion Soft, this segment is not necessarily relevant to you. It’s just one tool that we discuss it with and that’s one of the things that allows you guys to actually know “Well, if we spend ‘X’ with Google, how many clients did come in? How many converted into paying clients from prospective client and what the return on that investment in total is rather than just saying “Oh, we spent this much and we got so many leads?”

Yeah. I suppose we were like quite a number of Infusion Soft clients in the way that we bought Infusion Soft to go with the flow. They’re all serious marketers, particularly guys in America. When you looked at the little bar at the top of your screen you could see it was being driven by Infusion Soft and I think we thought if we had any pretentions at all of being good at this stuff, then we really needed Infusion Soft. So we bought Infusion Soft and we did the six one-hour online training sessions with a guy in Arizona and it seemed to me to be the most complicated thing in the world and consequently I think like a lot of other Infusion Soft users in the early stages it sat there and didn’t really do much.

Then there came a point where we thought we had a really smart idea that we could actually stick names, addresses, email addresses and telephone numbers in this, and so it then became the most expensive black address book that you could imagine because that’s really all we were using it for. Then, I guess, maybe two years ago Pieter came to see us with a view to understanding our processes and that in itself was very illuminating; to spend the weekend writing down on plastic white paper – if that’s the correct terminology – on the wall, exactly what all our processes were. I think I’d be honest enough to say that I think the vast majority of the processes we didn’t even know we had processes.

So that exercise in itself was very valuable, but then what we did do is we actually used the power of Infusion Soft to carry out a lot of this work that everyone was doing manually and individually within the business. And if we fast forward to present day, Infusion Soft actually runs the business now. Infusion Soft runs The Scottish Shutter Company. It took us a while to get there because we’d owned Infusion Soft for about four years and I don’t think back in the early days… I’m almost convinced that the guys from Infusion Soft back then who sold us the software weren’t really aware of the power of the beast that they had to offer, but it is incredibly powerful.
The trouble is with anything that’s incredibly powerful, it can be incredibly complicated to drive and understand and I think one of the things, the reason that Pieter and myself and Jean set up 48 Hour Launch was because we have that knowledge know. We’re trying to stop other business owners feeling that they have to open the Infusion Soft tool and get underneath and tinker with the engine because it is actually quite complicated, but it is an incredibly powerful tool used properly. It will completely automate your business.

Yeah. When you say about it being complex and it’s the same, it’s not just down to Infusion Soft, there are a lot of the tools we use. I mean, on the level that you operate within Adwords for the display network, your knowledge and expertise there. It’s quite interesting and I think all business owners suffer from this that I can’t imagine anyone I know who when the heating breaks down that their first thought is “I’d best go order a couple of books from Amazon. I need to get Gas Safe registered so that I can fix my boiler.” But for some reason when it comes to our own businesses, our mentality is “I need to be able to do this myself. I need to go and dig under the hood and see how it works.” There is a time and a place for that, but there’s also you have to ensure you’re going to grow your business and be serious about it. At some point you need to get people in who actually know exactly what they’re doing because you can spend your entire business career learning how to use these tools and then not actually running your business because in your family business in The Scottish Shutters, David and Judith now take charge of that. It’s all run by the machine. They have a team that do it all. Because it’s all fully automated and in place, you guys were for instance in December 2015 you were able to do double the turnover you did the previous December but without any additional staff just because it’s actually managed properly through a system and a process.

There’s also the side that Judith has. Judith has the dashboard that tells her exactly how many leads came in, how many measures they did. All the key stages of your business is visible at a glance without her needing to go into any of the detail or anything big and round in Infusion Soft for it.

Actually, to put that into real terms. Typically when I was actually working day in day out in the business, we were probably bringing in about 50 – 60 leads a month and we used to think “Goodness me, that’s our capacity limited. If we were going to bring more leads into the business, we need to find more staff.” I think as most business owners realise, finding the right staff with the right attitude in the right place at the right time was probably one of the most challenging things we can do. However, by turning over the running of the business almost to Infusion Soft and getting it systemised and getting processes written for everything that gets done in the business, then I think in the last… Well, Peter will have these statistics actually better than I do now, but I think in the last 30 days they must be up to about 170 leads, I think it is, Pieter?


Oh, goodness me. It gets bigger all the time. So 225 leads in a 30 day period where we used to think 50 and 60 that was us at capacity.
Now the interesting thing is there have been no changes in staff numbers. We have the same number of staff when we thought we were capacity limited at 50 – 60 leads a month as we have now, or as The Scottish Shutter – sorry, I can’t past saying ‘we’ because it was ‘we’ for 30 years. 225 new leads in the last 30 days. What does that mean to the business? Well, the Scottish Shutter Company business over the last five years, the marketing has relied very, very heavily on marketing to existing clients. The existing client list was gold. It was almost a licence to print money. Every campaign was based on creating some kind of compelling time limited offer to existing clients who were very kind in their numbers to participate in whatever offer. Interestingly, it never ceases to amaze me with the time limited offer which usually finishes at 4.59 on a Friday, the number of people who phone up in the last few minutes of the offer in order to make sure that they’re included.

It’s been a massive, massive shift in the way that The Scottish Shutter Company does business. We haven’t had to increase staff numbers. I remember sitting at 50 to 60 leads a month and thinking “We are going to have to take more people on. Goodness me, where will we find these people?” What we’ve got now are the same five people who are very good at what they do, but able to handle 225 leads in a 30 day period and that number is actually rising we know for a fact. We’ve got a campaign running just now that’s bringing in quite large quantities of leads on a daily basis.

I think a big part of the comfort in bringing in leads on that basis is once you have proper systems and processes in place you know that you don’t need to jump on every lead that comes through the door and try and sell them something there and then. You can put campaigns in place to specifically generate a list of leads who simply are people who have raised their hand to say “I am interested in the kinds of things you sell,” but because of the ongoing follow up and the tracking and everything that’s in place you guys will be able to tell six months from now when someone buys, that actually that came from ad spend from this month and therefore they’ve just upped your ROI rather than thinking “Okay, we spend ‘X’ on Google this month but we only made sales of this,” and thinking that’s your ROI. But actually being able to track it all the way through knowing what the value of the average value of a customer is, the life time, the life cycle of your customers and how long these things take, you don’t actually…. You’re in a position where you don’t actually mind generating a lead that doesn’t buy for three months because you know exactly where that spend came from and what that is.

That’s exactly right. If you think in the last 30 day period 225 leads, and we’ve simply just asked for a first name, last name and email address in return for a download. But basically these people are now tagged. We’ll now follow them and if for example 10 per cent of these people buy over the next six months to a year, that’s 22 additional orders – average order value say £2000. So there’s over £40,000 worth of additional revenue, but much more importantly given the business model that The Scottish Shutter Company it is that the most successful marketing is selling to your existing clients and that’s the same for a lot of businesses, although I think a lot of businesses miss that point; continually trying to find new clients. And this is what we do. I’m not saying that’s wrong, but there is also gold to be had in selling more products or more services to your existing database of clients.

So what this has done is – potentially if we use those numbers, if 10 per cent buy in the next six months, then we have 22 people who become existing clients, who we know statistically have a much higher percentage chance of buying from us in the future. So it’s an insurance in the future by doing this sort of marketing. Reaching out to people who have never heard of the company or who’ve never heard of the product or both.

Yeah, and just from going back to how you’re able to increase capacity within a business, not necessarily tied to The Scottish Shutter Company, but we even just in our business… I mean, there’s three of us. We are continually surprised at the amount of work we manage to get done but there’s a fourth member of the team which you’ll never hear from and you’ll never see and he’s known as ‘Woodchopper.’ He signs up for a lot of software applications and integrations and things that we set up and then we get reports on things that’s have been done. So we use Zapier very extensively in our own business and for clients and then we just get a weekly report saying “20 Zaps have done 120 tasks this week.”

The advantage for us is that’s 120 things that got done that we didn’t have to do. Yes, spend time setting the system and the process in place but once it’s there it frees you up to actually go and do much higher value work than pushing this around or ticking this box or making sure this email is sent, and gives you a consistency underlining the business that frees you up to carry on with the bits that you’re really good at and what you really need to do.

That’s a very important point and I think a lot of what we have in mind at 48 Hour Launch is freeing business owners up to actually genuinely get back to doing the thing that they enjoy doing – the thing that they probably set the business up to do in the first place. I think a lot of business owners will recognise this that every day, every week, every month they seem to be able to do less and less of the thing they’re really good at because there are so many other things that appear to want their attention in order for the business to function before even attempting to grow.

I think for a lot of businesses it’s not necessarily the owner. Let’s say the owner is an electrician and sets up an electrical contracting business. It’s not necessarily the owner having time to be on the calls because that’s the thing they set out to do, but it’s even just free the owner up to actually go and talk to customers because invariably the business owner is the best at generating and converting business. Most of our customers tell us “If I get the meeting, eight out of ten times I’m in business, but I don’t have time to get the meeting because I’m doing this and I’m doing this.”

That is so, so true, certainly in the last couple of years. I’ve been fortunate enough to talk to a lot of business owners in that period and almost without exception that what Pieter said there is absolutely true, that the business owner will say “If I can get in front of” or “if I can get the right potential client on the phone, we will win the business.” And the reason for that is a simple one – is because the business owner is passionate about what they do, and that comes over so that the customer, the prospective customer, senses this and then creates an engagement and that then ends up in a sale.

But it never ceases to amaze me that – and most business people who I talk to are pretty sensible. They know what they’re doing. They’re quite smart people but why wouldn’t you then spend 100 per cent of your time doing that because if you can get in front of the right people and you know you’ve got a 99.99 per cent chance of getting the business, why wouldn’t you spend all your day doing that and essentially that’s really the basis of ‘The One Thing’ by Jay Papasan and Gary Keller – about focusing on the one thing, the one most important thing in your business. That strikes me as the one most important thing.

Then I’ll speak to business owners to find out that they’ve spent a couple of days last week trying to understand Infusion Soft or they had a go at setting up some ads in Display Network in Adwords. Heaven forbid they try to advertise on Facebook, which actually is a really, really smart medium to use, but it changes on a daily basis so it becomes extremely complicated. It doesn’t matter if you go out and buy ‘The Idiot’s Guide to Advertising on Facebook’ or ‘The Idiot’s Guide to Managing your data in Infusion Soft,’ you’re never going to be an expert on it because it does take a long time to become an expert. And all the time, for every second – I’ve said this to a few business owners in the last week or two – for every second that you spend dicking about with something else that’s not the thing that you do best, you are losing money. You are taking money from your family, you’re taking money from your kids, you’re taking money from your lifestyle because you’ve already said that if you can get in front of the right type of person, you’ve got a very, very high per cent chance of getting the business, which means you’re able to put food on the table. You do the best for your family. You can have the lifestyle you want and why would you not do that or not attend to do that all the time?

So that’s what really 48 Hour Launch is all about. It’s trying to free the business owner up to get back to doing the bit they’re really passionate about, the bit that actually guarantees them a 99.9 per cent success rate and we see our task as just getting the right type of prospect in front of the business owner.

Yeah, that sounds good. You mentioned Facebook there. Facebook or Adwords?

Interesting point. Well, we will always refer back to market target message to media and we need to know who? Who you’re ideal audience is first of all. Where does your audience hang out? That then allows us to work out your marketplace. Then within that marketplace – because everybody in your marketplace isn’t necessarily your target audience – so we need to then refine that. Where’s the low hanging fruit? In your marketplace where are you likely to be more successful? Then we have to think about what are we going to say to this audience and then we choose the medium? If Adwords or Facebook is appropriate then we might use both. In fact we will say all three because we might use the Search Network. We might use the Display Network and we might use Facebook.

One thing to remember is that we’re using Adwords Search Network people are actively typing in hopefully your product or service right now. Now if you’re a locksmith and somebody’s locked themselves out of their apartment, then on their mobile phone they’re going to type “Need locksmith urgently locally.” Now that’s a perfect example of search, but if you have a product or service that people aren’t actively searching for because quite simply they don’t know you exist and they don’t know that your product or service exists, then the Search Network in Adwords is actually going to be quite difficult. It would then be a case of looking at what we call ‘interrupt marketing,’ where people are not actually searching for what you do right now. If they’re on Facebook they’re socially interacting with their friends. If they’re on the Internet they’re surfing the web looking at various website pages that they find interesting, and we then show our ads either on Facebook or in the Adwords Display Network to people at that point in time.

Now again with Facebook and Adwords Display Network a lot of the time we see people setting these up very badly – and I suspect through no real fault of business owners. They just feel that they need to be advertising on Facebook, so they try and set up Facebook ads. Most of the time, the biggest challenge is they are badly targeted and so a lot of money is being wasted, showing as the people who have no intention or no need or no desire for your product or service.

The secret with both Facebook and Google Display Network is that we can be very, very finally targeted and so if we are showing an appropriate eye catching, compelling ad to the right audience then we’ve got a good chance of getting in a click. So it is really definitely a case of horses for courses to answer your question, Pieter. We’d really want to know a bit more about the actual market, then who in that marketplace we target, what message we want to convey to them and then we would determine.
You just mentioned Facebook and Adwords, but there are many other places that we could target – LinkedIn, Instagram and indeed not necessarily paid traffic, but we could use direct mail, email, lumpy mail.

Let me just give you a good example there. If you know that you’re potential clients are all in a particular sector then it might not be a bad idea to buy a list with email addresses from that particular sector. Now that would allow us to do a number of things. We could of course send emails out. Be very, very careful – just a word of warning because I’ve seen this happen before. People buy lists and they’ve listened to some very, very smart marketer say that the secret is not to send one email but to send a sequence of emails out over a period of time. I’ve seen people buy a list to find out it’s a one-time use list, ie you can send one email to each person on that list and if you do more than that you’ve violated the conditions of the purchase. So be very, very careful when you’re list buying or list renting. You need multiple use if you plan to send multiple emails out and I’d certainly recommend sending multiple emails because people are not necessarily ready to buy when you are ready to send them email. You need to just keep front of mind until at some point they feel the need for your product or service.

The medium that you use really depends on the circumstances, but if you know that all your… I can think of somebody, a while back, who said to me all his clients were in the motor manufacturing industry and he would like to use Adwords. Well, quite frankly that’s pointless because a) there won’t be many people in the motor industry searching for the product or service that this guy had and secondly, a much easier route would be to find out at what level within the organisation were his existing clients. Usually it’s who’s get the special use of the funds? Who can sign off on a cheque? Then compile a list, really a dream list. My own experience of many years in sales is I’m not overly keen on sending people a letter or an email – or the days when I used to do this, a telex. The best bet is to introduce yourself on the telephone and set up an appointment, because business is only done either on a telephone conversation or face to face. Business is not done by email or by letter.

In that case someone came to me and said they only wanted to do Adwords. Well, with just a little bit of questioning it became apparent we could get to the target audience without going anywhere near any paid traffic. So understanding exactly who your audience is, where they hang out, really will help you determine whether it’s Adwords, Facebook or indeed is it paid traffic at all?

Just something I want to go back to what you said in regards Facebook or in general with having the appropriate message for the target audience and it ties in with why testing is so extremely important and testing every element of your campaign as it goes down the funnel because we ran a Facebook campaign recently for a client and the images that we used in the ads were primarily of good looking girls. It was very relevant to the campaign. It was very relevant to their business and we got very high click through rates, very low opt in rate and testing then made it clear to us that a lot of people were clicking on the ads because of the girls and not because they were interested in the service. They just wanted to see another photo of the girl in question, and therefore we had low opt in rates and you could spend a fortune on your ad and think “Oh, we get loads of clicks. We had loads of clicks” but the people who are clicking are not actually interested in the service you’re providing and that why you want your designing, your positioning of the ad itself, to be carefully planned and tested.

Yeah, there is actually a lot of bad advice by people I suspect who probably should know better because actually it’s written down in more than one place that a good Facebook ad would contain a picture of a young girl looking straight at the camera. I suspect that what’s happening there is people are saying that type of picture creates a lot of interest and that to me as a business owner is missing the point because it’s not interest I’m looking for, it’s paying customers. So having loads and loads of interest and no paying customers is absolutely pointless from my point of view.

Yeah. Okay. I think it is clear that we could carry on talking about this for as long as we wish, as we do every day anyway.

If anybody wants to find out any more about this, about us, about what we do, you can go to If you could leave a review, share our podcast about, that would be very helpful. We are running a live event on 12th May in the Midlands. You can get more information on that at You can sign up there. You can book a ticket and then hopefully we’ll see you there and we’ll go into a lot more detail in not just the advertising side of things but also the follow up – systems, processes, process management and design inside your business, and how to free you up to get back to actually doing the bits that you are extremely good at and that really moves the needle for your business.

That’s all from me. I’ll say goodbye.

And it’s goodbye from me.

See you next time! Bye.

Pieter K de Villiers

Pieter K de Villiers

Pieter K de Villiers is slightly obsessed with systems. The systems and process automation he builds for small businesses are transformative, to say the least. Pieter is a Co-Founder of Barefoot Digital and the Amazon best-selling author of “Barefoot Business: 3 key systems to attract more leads, win more sales and delight more customers without your business killing you”.


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Pieter K de Villiers

Author: Pieter K de Villiers

Pieter K de Villiers is slightly obsessed with systems. The systems and process automation he builds for small businesses are transformative, to say the least. Pieter is a Co-Founder of Barefoot Digital and the Amazon best-selling author of “Barefoot Business: 3 key systems to attract more leads, win more sales and delight more customers without your business killing you”.